Gauging Interest

[jetskidia]

At a recent meeting with a few of the " management" from here we discussed this years possible Sprinting events and options open to us.
There are basically 2 different options we can take, possibly both, but more than likely just one or the other.
The options are,
1. Join up with various MSA events and go along with all that entails, e.g, racing overalls, MSA license, ect,ect or,
2. Try and run our own more friendly, less official events like Haynes, ect
I have my own preference, but am keen to hear from all of you want you would prefer to partake in.

Look here please, http://www.lancerregister.com//showt...threadid=66479
Thanks

[mattty]

Hi I am doing NSCC this year with Kirko and his DP modded GTI-r and dral too with his Evo 7,

I would like to do some MLR stuff as well , I thought we were going to have a mini series or something for the MLR ?

edit to say vote cast

[jetskidia]

Please be aware that if we go the MSA route we will need to follow certain rules.
If we go the Non MSA route we can decide as a club what regs we need to stick to ourselves.

Below i've posted some of what is required by the MSA.

ROUGH GUIDE TO SPRINTING


Hillclimbing and Sprinting are races against the clock held mostly on specialised hillclimb tracks , race circuits and specialised sprint tracks. Cars start singly and are timed by electronic equipment accurate to 100th of a second. Cars compete in classes relative to their design, engine capacity and any modifications. Classes start with standard saloon cars and go through to Formula 1 type cars. This allows you to compete against cars of equal standing, giving everyone the chance of winning their class, with a special award for the overall fastest time of the day (FTD).

Sprinting is regulated by the Motor Sports Association (MSA) and in order to compete in these events there are certain requirements which must be followed. Firstly, you need to join an MSA affiliated car club, you can then apply for an MSA Competition Licence. With that licence comes the MSA yearbook (The Blue Book). Mandatory safety requirements include the need for a Crash Helmet and Fire Resistant Overalls, both to minimum requirements.

The next stage is to get your car prepared to the minimum standards in order to pass scrutineering. At the beginning of every meeting, a scrutineer will check your car to ensure it complies with necessary safety regulations.


PREPARING YOUR CAR

TIMING STRUT (BEAM BREAKER)

To enable you car to be timed it is mandatory to fit a Timing Strut (Beam Breaker) to the front of the car.

The Beam Breaker must be mounted vertically, on the front of the car, so that it's leading edge is the furthest forward point. It must be of solid material (ie metal or wood) and matt black. It must be 51mm wide, 254mm high with 200mm ground clearance.
It must be in place when presenting the car for scrutineering.

SILENCING

All vehicles must be silenced in accordance with the MSA Blue Book. Noise tests may take place so if you have a very noisy car, it is important to know how noisy it is.

SCRUTINEERING

The first thing to remember is that is the scrutineer's job to check your car for anything that might make it unsafe for motorsport, eg. Seat belts, Loose wheel bearings, worn steering or suspension, tyres etc.

All cars competing in Sprints must have a valid MSA Log Book, unless the car is currently licenced for use on the public highway and competing in the event in a road legal condition. This can be obtained on the day from the Scrutineer, but he will require photographs showing the side elevation of the car which will be attached inside the log book. (The cost is approx £25.00 for the scrutineer to produce this log book)



The scrutineer will also be checking for other points such as:

Driver's seat securely fixed
Battery earth lead must be indicated by yellow (tape is generally good enough)
A sticker showing clearly the direction of off on the ignition switch
Competition numbers displayed (Black or white on contrasting background) on both sides of the car


PREPARING YOURSELF

HELMETS

A crash helmet must be worn during competition and the following standards are accepted by the FIA, CIK and the MSA (Year 2002)

The helmet must bear one of the following standards:


BS 6658 Type A/FR Snell SA95 *, Snell SA2000
SFi Foundation Sfi spec 31.1*, SFi Foundation Sfi spec 31.2 *

MSA events only - BS 6658-85A (Type B is not acceptable)

The 'Gold' stickers are not valid after 1.1.2001. Helmets currently approved and which will be valid after that date will require a new (Blue) sticker. The are available from issuing scrutineers.

The helmet must be a good fit and in good condition with no damage to the shell or securing straps. (See Regulation 10 in the MSA Year Book - which
comes automatically with all MSA licence applications.)

The helmet must carry the current MSA approval sticker which, is the helmet conforms to all of the above, is available at a nominal cost from an MSA scrutineer.


OVERALLS

Clean flame resistant overalls are required to FIA Standard. For MSA events, they may manufactured to a standard BS 6249 part 1 index A or B, but not C, BSEN 533 or PREN533: 1993 INDEX 3. These standards are clearly marked on the overalls. Although not yet mandatory, flame resistant gloves, socks, balaclavas and underwear are strongly recommended. Helmet, overalls, Goggles (or a visor) must be worn at all times while driving an open race car. Other safety data applies in closed vehicles.


More details on Helmet and Overall requirements (particularly as regards safe keeping and care) can be found in the Blue Book.


MSA LICENCE

An MSA Licence must be obtained in order to compete in Sprints.



HOW TO GET AN MSA COMPETITION LICENCE

Having already joined an MSA affiliated Car Club , you can obtain a licence application form from the address below or by downloading off the Web on www.msauk.org

The Motor Sports Association Ltd.,
Motor Sports House,
Riverside Park,
Colnbrook,
Slough,
SL3 0HG.

Telephone: 01753 681736

The are basically two types of licence applicable to hilclimbing and sprinting:

National B Non Race

This will allow you to enter most hillclimbs and sprints with the exception of the higher grade National A events.

Approx cost: £28.50

Speed National A

This allows you to enter all types of hillclimbs and sprints but cannot be applied for straight away. You must upgrade from a National B and this can only come about by experience and competing on the track.

Approx cost: £45.00

Note:

For a driver to compete in a Racing or Sports Libre car manufactured after 31/12/1960 of more than 2000cc (or 1428cc if forced induction) he must hold a National A Speed or Race Licence.

Once again, when you receive your licence, you will get a copy of the MSA Yearbook (Blue Book), which gives the technical specifications for every type of British Motorsport.



HOW TO ENTER AN EVENT


After deciding which event you wish to enter, and ensuring that your club is invited, you must obtain a set of Entry Regulations, either from your own or the organising club's Competition Secretary.

Having filled in the entry form and sent it off with the appropriate fee and assuming that your entry is accepted, you will normally receive final instructions on what you should be doing in the week prior to the event.

The final instructions usually give details of all of the entries in class and number order, which enables you to have your numbers ready in time for the event. They also detail the timetable for the day, where you should park on arrival and when to arrive etc.


ON THE DAY

On arrival park your car in the appropriate area and proceed to the signing on hut with your appropriate documents (MSA Licence, Club card etc). After signing on you must then have your car passed by a scrutineer and preferably, walk the course prior to the first practice runs. It is advisable to arrive early to allow enough time for all these things. (Generally you should allow to get to the course between 1.5 and 2 hours before the first practice run )

You are now ready to compete and just have to wait for your practice runs to be called before proceeding to the start. It is important that you listen to and obey all marshals and officials on the day.

[mojo]

Quote "Please be aware that if we go the MSA route we will need to follow certain rules.
If we go the Non MSA route we can decide as a club what regs we need to stick to ourselves."

Please be aware .....

....as I understand things the MSA are, in effect, the authorising body for ALL motorsport in the UK.

If they have not authorised an event, it maybe classed as "Illegal". You certainly would not have any insurance, 3rd party or corporate. The organisers of the event could well face insurance claims, and in the case of death, that would be horrendous. (I think an MSA authorised event coverage is now up to £20 million ??)

Again, as I understand things, the permit, or waiver of permit, that is issued by the MSA "legalises" what could be described as the wreckless/careless/dangerous driving by cars competing on private land
(a law was brought in to allow police to stop yobs etc. fooling around in car parks etc.)
So police interference is probable. (They can stop the event - because it is not authorised.)

soooo - I don't think it is THAT simple ........

[jetskidia]

Thanks for your post Mojo,
although you have raised some good and valid points, I dont think every thing you have said is 100% accurate.
I'm sure it is not illegal to run an event on private land with the landowners permission.
I also dont believe that the Police could stop an event, that is on private land with the landowners permission,
they couldnt even stop that yob who won the lottery, making his neighbours life a complete nightmare by playing "Banger cars" in his garden.
If we run an event outside of the MSA umbrella we are intending on having medical cover.

[BHP]

Hello Chris.
Personally I would say option 2, just like our old Dunkerswell and Haynes Sprints. Basically, a run wot you brung for the fun of it.

Going the MSA route makes these events more formal, plus I guess more expense to the sprinters having to buy racesuits, boots etc... and possibly a bit more car prep.

[Bridger]

Originally posted by jetskidia
If we run an event outside of the MSA umbrella we are intending on having medical cover.

Just look into it carefully. I have been down this route and it is not easy. Public liability is the biggy. As long as you make sure that everything will be safe and kosher, go ahead and try. The MSA will try and shut you down (in all likeliness).
It is much easier to do it through a car club that is affiliated to the MSA.

[jetskidia]

Originally posted by Bridger
Just look into it carefully. I have been down this route and it is not easy. Public liability is the biggy. As long as you make sure that everything will be safe and kosher, go ahead and try. The MSA will try and shut you down (in all likeliness).
It is much easier to do it through a car club that is affiliated to the MSA.

It is only my personal opinion, but to put it mildly the MSA is a million miles away from being helpfull

Running an event through a car club affiliated to the MSA is far from ideal, I'm pretty sure if thats what people want, they are already doing it.

Thanks for your response, btw

[moses]

our own haynes

bream races with the best, nae chance we can take them on maybe only a few not all of us
haynes will be cool coz u compete with fellow members

[Red Mist]

Chris,

I'd probably give option 2 a go , but couldnt be ar5ed with the MSA mallarcky,

cheers

Darryl

[chockymonster]

I enjoy the haynes events, it's inexpensive, good fun and there is no pressure.
If it was regulated to the MSA style and I had to go through that malarky I just wouldn't bother.

[Weebl]

Voted

Option 2 for me please Chris

[ashills]

option 2 sounds good

[Mark]

Hi Chris,

I personally think more events like Haynes like would be better. I'm sure there are a few that would prefer something more offical, but I think most of those are probably already competing in sprints.

For most (we'll me any way) I think the Haynes sprint are no pressure and very cheap way to experience motorsport. It also gives people that have not done aything like this before an excelent introduction aswell.

Do you forsee any insurance problems like when you tried to arrange the Sprint a Llandow?

Cheers

Mark

[jetskidia]

Originally posted by marky
Hi Chris,



Do you forsee any insurance problems like when you tried to arrange the Sprint a Llandow?

Cheers

Mark

Yes and No