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My dyno results

13K views 130 replies 23 participants last post by  WhiteDemon 
#1 · (Edited)
Hi guys

I rebuilt my engine 2 years ago, when i remap the car i expected something about 410/420hp with my specs but i only have 401hp so i would like a second advice if that i must expeted or it was a problem with my remap

Specs
2L longrod
Cp 85.5mm 2.3L strock pistons
ACL bearings
kiggly racing springs
Ferrea comp valves stock size
Jun 272 cams
Hks 1.2mm head gasket
Stock turbo (evo 9 gsr)
Stock maniforld
Stock elbow
70mm downpipe
200cell cat
Stock air box
Stock pipe and IC
Stock injectors

And that's it



What do you think guys?
 
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#64 · (Edited)
concerning my EHX cams hi spoke with someone with greats skill with evos and he told me that:


"The JUN 272 has 235 degrees of duration at 1mm lift. I would leave the EXH cam at 0 (115 deg).

The best results will come from using MIVEC to advance the intake cam in the midrange (2500-5000 rpm)."

There are too many theoris about this
 
#73 ·
I am wondering why everyone is debating the cams and all when the OP has a turbo that cant really produce more than 400 hp on pump fuel, runs somewhat low boost up top even for that turbo and has 8:1 CR to boot..

also, since he has non stock cams and forged engine, the knock can be false..
 
#84 ·
I am wondering why everyone is debating the cams and all when the OP has a turbo that cant really produce more than 400 hp on pump fuel, runs somewhat low boost up top even for that turbo and has 8:1 CR to boot..

also, since he has non stock cams and forged engine, the knock can be false..
That's what I was thinking right from the first post. Figures are ok with using those standard parts.

As for the knock, **** knows. :lol:
 
#79 ·
Ok bullet points to avoid sarky accusations-

10.0-10.5:1 AFR. Mental. Only an idiot would map it that rich. 12:1 at peak rpm with correct ignition and knock setup is fine

Yes turbo engines can run very lean, just look at F1. Beyond stoich and cutting edge turbo technology. Expert calibrators.

Cam at zero. This does not mean 115 degree centreline. You have machined head and deck faces. This reduces the height and swings the cams. To know your true centreline requires a dial indicator and degree wheel.

Knock readings. You have changed bore, pistons, rods, cams, valve springs, more. The stock knock setup is no use to you. You could be into heavy knock and it is not showing but killing your engine already or you could be a long way from it and way off power potential. Retune with minimum knock headphones or better frequency analysis.

Set cams correctly. Set knock correctly. Map ignition to suit and retard each cylinder to suit. AFR 12:1 at peak rpm beyond 2 bar is fine on good pump gas. Anything less is guesswork or possibly bad advice.
 
#87 ·
the usual "dyno queen" map will use about 12 to 12.5 AFR for best power... however I advise you to take an evo on the track and log EGT on long straights. I did so and I know why I never go leaner than 11-11.5 on full power, and probably end on 11 on WOT at the track on stock frame turbo..

also, unless the OP is runing a standalone he will ot be able to "retard each cylinder to suit"
 
#81 ·
Hi Fujimoto

The EXH cam i can do this no problème but im not a mapper so for the knock and afr i need trust someone

I have all i need to remap the car but not the knowledge
This is the hard part. Ask the questions I have presented to a potential mapper. If they tell you it is not required then keep searching.

With the cam. Having variable inlet it is easy to swing on dyno but you also need to swing the exhaust. So even if you set with degree wheel you may need to change when at dyno. Slow process doing combinations of positions. Good luck.
 
#82 ·
I think consensus seems to be there is plenty to do on the hardware settings side before proper tuning can be done.
I am yet to hear a case of a blown motor with too rich mixture :)
Plenty examples of destroyed hardware at the lean side of the spectrum
Absolutely true, the leaner the better, no discussion here. Number itself is not really important.
I own a modern factory stock twincharger 4-pot running low 10's AFR at WOT above 5k rpm - for the risk of ruffling feathers I'd risk a statement that the engineers who specialize in mapping cars working for that top automotive manufacturer who spent thousands of hours mapping that engine must be mental idiots ;).

Different engines have different needs. If you start from very rich and keep leaning it out you will find the point where your motor runs the sweetest to be simplistic. Cannot do it if you don't do the basics mind you - as others advised :).

I'd be cautious comparing F1 to 20 or so year old Evo motor lol. It's like comparing "Electronics set for Children" with Intel i7 fabbing :).

I'd follow Fujimoto's and others advice on getting the basics right first :).
 
#93 ·
BTW you don'r know WTF you're on about when it comes to knock.

The stock sensor is a resonant type which outputs a single frequency which has nothing to do with bore size.

You've been sucked in, no different from the flat earthers.

Stock knock detection works very well despite changes made to the engine.
 
#92 · (Edited)
Fuelling controls the temperature in cylinders. Increase in fuelling is used in turbo charged engines (and sometimes in high compression N/A high performance motors) to control cylinder temperatures. This is a simple fact. AFR increase is one of the tools used to allow more timing and/or boost otherwise not possible due to detonation caused by too high temperatures. It is very simple and safe to increase the fuelling top end and see if problem persists. If it does then here is no point in doing it as problems is somewhere else and time to take the motor out and try other things. Start from easy diagnostic solutions instead of stripping the motor down straight away. EGT per cylinder check is even easier. So yes, I still think that AFR was the way to go, at least initially.

Now, having seen all the other info and graphs posted I can tell that enriching the mixture would do nothing as ECU pulls timing back too much as soon as throttle is applied and boost doesn't hold either and that is at relatively low rpm. That might indicate Intake an closing too early causing too high DCR and detonation.

Conversely all might be perfect but mentioned phantom knock is fooling the ECU into cutting everything out.

For the avoidance of doubt, that low AFR is only to be used where temperatures are a problem.
 
#109 ·
When you come to have it mapped here in U.K. Be mindful that quite a few tuners do Duno Queen tunes which are fine in U.K. for street driving but will spectacularly fail on say track day use or Autobahn driving - have a search through German Evo forums :).
 
#110 ·
Each year I take my car back to the UK for servicing, MOT, new work that I need and often a remap afterwards; it's a nice drive back from the Alsace region.

I use Bob at Dynotech for all my work and then have Lee5 map her and everything seems to work absolutely spot on. They're based in Kent so very convenient to get to once you come over on the Eurotunnel...

Another alternative is that my friend who lives around the corner from me has his 9 mapped by a guy who used to map Tommi's car back in the day(!!!), he's based in Strasbourg and (if you can get hold of him) will road map your car.

I spent roughly half a day with him the last time he came down and my friends car goes so well and so strong. If you're interested I could perhaps get you his contact info however you'd need to get all the work done first of course..?
 
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